Faber, RN) around 2220A/7 hours and landing operation commenced shortly afterwards. Of course, if Britain has committed to keeping carrier capability then it may well be the AEW.7 instead which was to have a rotodome much like the E-2 Hawkeye and subsequently significantly improved capability. Its not as straightforward as many people make out. With them were also transports from convoy KMS A1. The war needed to have been fought as long as the Argentinians held the Falklands. The island surrendered shortly before noon without further fighting. Dempo (Dutch, 17024 GRT, built 1931), Yarde-Buller, RNVR), HMS Gardenia (T/Lt. Something needs to carry the Chinooks and Wessexes after all. HMS Falkland (1696) was a 54-gun fourth-rate ship of the line, purchased in 1696. Two submarines were stationed off the beaches as beacons, these were HMS Ursula (Lt. R.B. Falklands War. HMS Glamorgan was a County-class destroyer of the Royal Navy with a displacement of 5,440 tonnes. The ship was built by Vickers-Armstrongs in Newcastle Upon Tyne and named after the Welsh county of Glamorgan. Having another capital ship, which was an Audacious class aircraft carrier equipped with McDonnell Douglas Phantom FG.1 alongside Blackburn Buccaneers, would have been a huge asset, and. North, RN), HMS Zetland (Lt. J.V. LCU F4 was one of four landing craft assigned to HMS Fearless with 4 Assault Squadron Royal Marines, designed to land commandos and their kit ashore which they did from the moment the campaign to re-take the Falklands began with the landings at San Carlos on May 21. Lochmonar, L.H. J.G.Y. The turn had prevented the missile from striking the ship's side perpendicularly and penetrating; instead, it hit the deck The blast travelled forwards and down, and the missile body, still travelling forwards, penetrated the hangar door, causing the ship's fully fuelled and armed On the following day, repairs were made at sea and, after the Argentinian surrender on 14 June, more extensive repairs were undertaken in the sheltered bay of A Memorial was erected in 2011 in memory of the ship and the lost crew at Hookers Point outside Stanley.Her last active deployment for the Royal Navy was in 1983/4 and she was sent on the Armilla Patrol with MoD release detailing date and position of sinking, 25 July 2008 This was a Rothesay class anti-submarine frigate built at Portsmouth and completed in 1960. Around 1815A/7, the section destined for ' C Sector ' (Charlie Sector) parted company with the convoy. Can you expand on this? However, sadly the aircraft carriers which replaced her were not able to be equipped with traditional aircraft. Edward Ruthledge (American, 7177 GRT, built 1942), Had she kept her late 1970s air group into 1982, she would have had: 3-4x Gannet AEW.3s (Flight from 849 Squadron). However one realty remained that governed everything. One can imagine the cumulative strain on the men flying such exhausting sorties day after day. Orbita, H.F. Nash, RN), destroyer HMS Vansittart (Lt.Cdr. It would certainly render the need.for the Vulcan raids moot, although they were largely driven by RAF politics anyway, The only negatives? D.P. The AEW version of the Sea King arrived in theatre after the fighting was over. A.G. Forman, DSC, RN), HMS Loyal (Lt.Cdr. G.L.D. We (in 1982) are a major NATO nation, a nuclear power with multiple tactical nukes as well as Polaris. They were escorted by the minesweepers HMS Clacton (A/Lt.Cdr.(Retd.) Weather was to bad to land at Lampion Island but the island appeared to be uninhabited. Of course, the small Gannet force would also have been terribly fragile. They were brought into Bizerta where their cargo was unloaded. It would have changed things, but I don't think it would have made it that much easier. Keeping her was not a choice that could have been made, just a matter of how long the last of her spare parts (most recycled from Eagle) would keep working. Bennetts, RN), HMS Bramham (Lt. E.F. Baines, DSO, RN), HMS Cowdray (Lt.Cdr. L.J.S. On the 4th May 1982 she was struck by an Exocet air-launched missile fired from an Argentinian Navy Super Etendard aircraft. But in the Royal Marines and Royal Navys Amphibious Warfare community, the loss of the 30-metre-long craft, with four Marines and two Sailors, resonates to this day. Around 0200A/6, the destroyers HMS Broke (Lt.Cdr. KMS O1 then proceeded to the westwards so as to pass the Straits of Gibraltar later. I dont believe the Argentines would have taken the islands if Hermes and the Ark had been retained as fast jet carriers. Fraser, RNR) and the M/S trawlers HMS Hoy (T/Lt. A.C. Whitcombe, RNR), HMS Mull (T/Lt. Russell, RN), HMS Vanoc ( A/Cdr. Landing Craft (Utility) Foxtrot Four was the last Royal Navy vessel lost in the six-week war in the South Atlantic, attacked on the same day June 8 as the more well-known tragedy of Sir Galahad and Sir Tristram and the 200 casualties they suffered when bombed. tiger and bulwark were looked at, tiger was a mess and would have needed a comprehensiveRead more . Cant recall anyone at the time suggesting it should have remained in-service: surely the RN had its hands full in trying to ensure a speedy delivery of the Invincible class? Sobo (British, 5353 GRT, built 1937), Comments may automatically be held for moderation by our team, they will be approved as soon as possible in accordance with our. It would have changed were the weaknesses lay. Same problems with the QE2 class other than the fact that they are brand new. They also tried Bulwark and pretty much the same answer. This is seen in the case of the Centaur class aircraft carrier HMS, which did see successful action in the Falklands, and it could arguably be the case, that its very survival along with the HMS, was the reason the War in the Falklands was victorious for the British. A.C. Elton, RNR). V/STOL carriers can keep operating in worse sea states than conventional carriers my understanding is Ark wouldnt have been able to recover her aircraft for much of the war, making her useless. Having another capital ship, which was an Audacious class aircraft carrier equipped with McDonnell Douglas Phantom FG.1 alongside Blackburn Buccaneers, would have been a huge asset, and potentially could have made a difference in the Falklands War and perhaps even have prevented it. Chattanooga City, Ensuring the security of home and international waters is central to the stability and prosperity of Britain and the world economy. Now add in the Phantom's ability to go supersonic and the additional range of the SkyFlash. Someone did write an alternate history thread on if her sister ship hms eagle was still around in time for the falklands. Walt Whitman (American, 7176 GRT, built 1942), AR's Phantoms were certainly not equal to the dozens of Tomcats and Hornets the US carriers were cutting about with at the time but they were still solid aircraft, probably easily superior to the Argentine Daggers, Mirages and Skyhawks though numbers would be an issue, albeit one massively offset by each F-4 carrying 4 Skyflash SARH missiles plus 4 Sidewinders compared to the mere 2 Sidewinders of the Sea Harriers. HMS Spey remained with the damaged ship. Maintaining a state of readiness to protect the interests of Britain and our allies. i doubt she would have even got to the falklands. Community Hospital Eportal, Urlana. J.D.L. W.R. Slayter, DSC, RN, flying the flag of Rear-Admiral C.H.J. Indeed AV, it was Callahans decision to withdraw the SSN patrol from the South Atlantic in 1977 that really got the Argentines convinced we had lost interest in our South Atlantic territories. N.A.F. Therefore its likely that it would have never have crossed the Airforce mind to deploy theirs on ships. The same can be said about the fighters on Ark Royal. HMS Spey by that time had departed with the ships 24 landing craft in which the ships troops had embarked. At 2135A/7, the beacon submarine HMS P 45 (Lt. H.B. theres no way big lizzie and fat taff will give 50 years service. Gelling, DSC, RD, RNR). F.Y. There has been a lot of bagging of the invincible class, and the harriers, by many, and lamenting about the glory days of the big carriers is an easy thing to do. Tiba (Dutch, 5239 GRT, built 1942), The buccaneers of 809 could have hit the argue Air Force on the ground with buddy buddy refueling and phantom escort. For full functionality of this site it is necessary to enable JavaScript. Groups VI and VII were escorted by the light (AA) cruiser HMS Delhi (Capt. Gannets were located and in process ofRead more , This is a narrow and silly proposition. Once your force of twelve F-4s is reduced to ten, or eight, or six serviceable airframes it all starts to look a little more tenuous.". arks cmplement of aircraft would have been bolstered with harries perhaps taken from atlantic conveyor, where numerous air assets were lost. Tadorna (British, 1947 GRT, built 1928), Miller, DSC, RNR) and HMS Jonquil (Lt.Cdr. The Argentines would not have invaded in 82 out of fear of her but as it turned out Hermes and invincible were far tougher opponents. Salacia, Protecting our nations interests: guardian, diplomat and humanitarian force for good. They were escorted by the AA ship HMS Pozarica, escort destroyers HMS Bicester, HMS Bramham, frigate HMS Rother, minesweeper HMS Cadmus, MS trawlers HMS Juliet, HMS Rysa, HMS Stroma and the motor launches HMS ML 283, HMS ML 336 and HMS ML 338. W.R.K. Argentinas junta were making threats against the Falklandsagain trying to draw attention away from domestic problems. Bulwark and either Tiger or Blake, not sure which, where up the trot at Guz. Group VII, 1st division, Empire Mordred, Havildar, Pacific Exporter and St. Essylt. Intensive and increasingly unsuccessful maintenance and a new programme of continuous servicing and repair with RN maintenance ships always in her task groups, kept her going until late 1978, with increasing mechanical and electrical failures-leading to decommission in Nov 1978. Saner minds prevailed and they didnt reactivate any of them. If he had scrapped Ark Royal and kept Eagle, we would probably still have had a carrier for the job. Whether its dealing with the demands of deployment or the rigours of relocation, we make sure that the family and friends of Naval Service personnel have all the help, guidance and support they need, every day. Our presence is key to achieving this. Oxborrow, DSC, RN). Historically, the Task Force had a patchy and perilous early warning systems. Around 1000A/4, the convoy was split up into two sections KMS A1 and KMS O1. HMS Rhyl Two ships of the Royal Navy have been named HMS Rhyl, after the town of Rhyl in Wales: HMS Rhyl (J36) was a Bangor -class minesweeper launched in 1940 and sold in 1948. Biggs, DSO, DSC, RN) and HMS Speedwell (Lt.Cdr. The indication to the Argentineans was that we no longer wanted/had the will to defend the islands. C.G.V. W. Harmsen, RNN) and HMS Escapade (Cdr. Menzies, RN), HMS Penelope (Capt. HMS. Given the state of her engines by the time she was retired Im not sure in she couldveRead more . Partington, RD, RNR) departed Gibraltar to join convoy KMF A1. I was based at Chattenden across the water from Chatham at the start of the Falklands and HMS Bulwark was still hanging around in the Dockyard. blakes 6 inch gun used in ngs role would have been invaluable, plus she had an armoured hull. The biggest issue for Ark Royal would have been the weather. A.B. Dempo, I wonder if we will ever learn? R. Patterson, SANF(V)), HMS Albacore (Lt.Cdr. The need was the Gannet AEW. Mooltan, St.J.R.J. C.R. Clark, DSC, RD RNR), 20 LCI(L)'s and 2 ML's. R.V.E. The headquarters ships HMS Bulolo (Capt.(Retd.) HMS Glamorgan was a County-class destroyer of the Royal Navy with a displacement of 5,440 tonnes. Winchester Castle. Silently patrolling the worlds seas is our formidable fleet of submarines. Northey, DSC, RN). Even Thatcher asked if Ark could be used in 82 but was told she was too far gone with scrapping well underway. It was made up of the USS Almaack, USS Leedstown, USS Samuel Chase, Exceller and Dempo. Harcourt, CBE, RN), escort carrier HMS Biter (Capt. Around 0535A/7, in position 3734'N, 0001'W, the attack transport USS Thomas Stone was torpedoed and damaged by an enemy aircraft. Salacia (British, 5495 GRT, built 1937), Ninja Arashi Mod Apk, Trentham, RN), minesweepers HMS Brixham, HMS Bude, HMS Clacton, HMS Felixtowe, HMS Polruan (Lt.Cdr.(Retd.) Questo sito Web utilizza i cookie per migliorare la tua esperienza. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Temple, DSC, RN). Buccaneers flew low over Belize City to reassure residents. [1] For a list of naval forces from Argentina, see Argentine naval forces in the Falklands War. The carriers first line O.R. Taking on another country? G.L.D. She was the first warship to be built in what would become the United States. Retaining HMS Ark Royal,anAudaciousclass aircraft carrier,would have been beneficial in the Falklands War and perhaps even prevented it. All forces sailed on 10 June to be off Pantellaria on 11 June 1944. IF you keep the Ark, then youve picked expeditionary warfare. Obviously, Galtieri and his gang launched the invasion to distract attention from their domestic problems, and as I said before, in the expectation that Britain lacked the will to do anything militarily, irrespective of what forcesRead more . Generations of our political leaders are quite disgraceful. Could they have spared the destroyermen from their sacrificial picket duty? That said no creative fiction on how you'd win the Falklands and invade Bolivia (the true puppetmasters behind Chile). Halcrow, RD, RNR), HMS Pentstemon (Lt.Cdr.(Retd.) Tegelberg and Shaw, RNR) and HMS Felixstowe (T/Lt. Recorder, Delinlian, 14 Comments HMS Sheffield was a Type 42 guided missile destroyer, the first of fourteen Type 42 destroyers to enter the Royal Navy service plus two that, ironically entered Argentinian Navy. Likely in wartime boosted up a bit. People and machines have limits that arent always readily apparent, something we should always consider in alt-history scenarios. Click here to Submit events/comments/updates for this vessel. I could be wrong, but I thought John Nott was Minister for Defence at the time. Group VIII, LST HMS Bachaquero (A/Lt.Cdr.(Retd.) Connect with like-minded people and develop a peer-to-peer support network both online and at community centres. a large combat aiar patrol would have certainly have given the opportunity to stop incoming attacks in san carlos where antelope and ardent were lost, possibly coventry would have had air protection which may not have seen her lost. Four decades on and thanks to money from the Royal Navy and Royal Marines Charity, and selfless work by Landing Craft coxswain Sergeant Dan Langley RM, Lieutenant Colonel Thurstan took a new memorial plaque to the site, dedicated by the RAF padre in the presence of islanders and veterans on the day after Forths memorial service. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, Deputy Chief of Staff for Operations and Mandatory Fun, https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/hms-eagle-in-the-falklands.447558/. When off Cape Bon on 9 November, they were taken under fire by Vichy French coastal batteries, despite the darkness, and then captured by motor torpedo boats. R.L. Please leave a comment below if you have something to say! Havildar (British, 5401 GRT, built 1940), Obviously a third carrier would have been beneficial and given us greater odds. 9228 Bay Avenue, North Beach, Md, C.G. Colthurst, RN), AA ship HMS Alynbank (A/Capt.(Retd.) Awatea, C.W. The rescue of many crewmen from HMS Antelope by the craft, under difficult conditions, earned Foxtrot 4s coxswain Colour Sergeant Brian Johnston RM the Queens Gallantry Medal. Storey, RN) also departed Gibraltar to join the convoy. The last two would have seriously altered the shore bombardment profile if they where available. Group V; Alcinous, Alphard, Charles H. Cramp, Chatanooga City, Delilian, Recorder and Zebulon B. Vance. She would have needed another large refit which would have taken several years given her condition in 1979. G.H. We are cursed by Governments who seem to ignore their first duty Defence of the Nation Hammond is a first class example of an idiot who with a wave of the hand stresses we only need an Army of 50,000 . They had the same escort as Group III. I think its doubtful the task force would have attempted to retake the islands if they only had a very old and unreliable carrier to send. Say a 18/12 split, though that's my opinion at this point. Modern day list of ships supposedly lost by the British in the Falklands War, still showing Invincible and Hermes as considered or possibly sunk or damaged the old myths die hard: Here a more recent Argentine photograph from the press shows an impressive attack against HMS Penelope with the caption A greeting to your Queen: The landing ships Dewdale and Ennerdale were also part of the convoy. From convoy KMS A1 the following ships were assigned to ' A Sector '; City of Worcester, Ennerdale, Glenfinlas, Jean Jadot, Lochmonar, Ocean Rider, Ocean Volga, Sobo, Stanhill, Tiba and Urlana. Then there was the weather. Oliver is a student at the University of East Anglia studying for a PhD in International Security. Sherwood, RNR). R.deL. They were manned by Royal Naval personnel, mainly from 1st MCM Squadron based at Rosyth. My argument here is that with the ability to launch fixed-wing aircraft which HMS. Abel Smith, RN), destroyer HMS Clare (Lt.Cdr. Armstrong, DSC, RD, RNR), HMS Royal Ulsterman (A/Lt.Cdr. Pugsley, DSO, RN), HMS Nubian (Cdr. From that moment, war was inevitable as the junta could not have backed down and survived. J.L. A.A. Martin, DSC, RD, RNR), HMS Rhyl (Cdr. Harper, RNR), HMS Hoy (T/Lt. Good points. At 0535A/8 the tug St. Day joined which also passed a tow. First up, a navy with Ark Royal would be an utterly different navy. William M. Wirt (American, 7191 GRT, built 1942) and They were escorted by the light cruiser HMS Jamaica, escort destroyers HMS Calpe (Lt.Cdr. The radar only had an effective range of a 100 miles. Fraser, RNR) and the motor launches HMS ML 280, HMS HDML 1127. L.S. Brooke, DSO, DSC and Bar, RN). Winchester Castle (British, 20012 GRT, built 1930). Topic: PeopleRemembrance Lycaon (British, 7350 GRT, built 1913), HMS Rhyl Ships Nostalgia is the forum and discussion board for all things ships and shipping, providing a friendly community, advanced discussion board, gallery and more for your use. Civilian trawlers converted to Extra-Deep Armed Team Sweep (EDATS) with some extempore acoustic and sonar equipment. Sampson, RNVR), HMS Rhyl (Cdr. Let's start with early warning. Sinclair, RN), HMS Amazon (Lt.Cdr.(Emgy.) But I think the simple question is would we have been better of with just HMS Ark Royal, or as it was Illustrious and Hermes and personally Id say no. These ships were considered expendable. Around 0800A/3, the destroyer HMS Marne (Lt.Cdr. There weren't enough Gannets to cover every possible approach to the amphibious force in San Carlos Water or the carriers NE of the islands. Maron (British, 6487 GRT, built 1930), Graham, RNR) and HMS Tasajera (Lt.Cdr. It wasnt the capability which failed to deter it was the will to use it. When did the US military officially adopt tank names? Take the helos off and you might get a few more Phantoms on and as the air threat is going to be the issue here and the Phantoms can also do ground attack, the Buccs may well lose a couple to get the fighter number up. I heard that the the yanks were impressed by the Bucks at Red Flag. M.D.C. Meyrick, RN) also departed to join the convoy. HMS Escapade and HMS Marne were apparently detached to Gibraltar on the convoy passing the Strait of Gibraltar. The F-4 was undoubtedly a more capable naval interceptor than the Sea Harrier. Churchill, RN) and HMS Wrestler (Lt. R.W.B. The Tories had promised in their election to strengthen the forces. The cruisers and fleet destroyers then proceeded to Lampedusa. McGrath, RN), HMS Karanja (Lt.Cdr.(Emgy.) Leedstown, WebOriginal Royal Navy Photograph. More penny pinching by yet another Government. i, d say not just the will, but and this is where my worries around comrade corbyn come in, the bravery and ambition to prepare beforehand for the likeliest source of future aggression. Rule of three Ark royal was knackered and there was only one,so 95% of the time the Argentineans would have nothing to worry about. Big pinches of salt need to be taken when he speaks. Barstow, RN), HMS Verity, (Lt.Cdr. Twin Auto 6inch and twin Auto 3 Inch turrets would have ruined any ashore forces day. On assembly the convoy was escorted by the escort carrier HMS Avenger (Cdr. could have made a difference in the Falklands War and perhaps even have prevented it. Ark's Gannets had an endurance of five hours. The surrender of Linosa Island was accepted by HMS Nubian. F.T. From convoy KMS A1 the following ships were assigned to ' A Sector '; Dewdale, Lalande, Manchester Port, Ocean Viceroy and Ocean Wanderer. They were escorted by the AA ship HMS Tynwald, escort destroyers HMS Cowdray, HMS Zetland, sloop HMS Enchantress, minesweepers HMS Algerine, HMS Hussar, HMS Speedwell, corvettes HMS Pentstemon, HMS Samphire, MS trawlers HMS Cava, HMS Othello and the motor launches HMS ML 273 and HMS ML 295. No reason why Harriers, if deployed on CATO-BAR carriers in the Falklands War couldnt be Catapulted, and Land STOVL? Also the issue if space remains, and all of the conveyors harriers where already disembarked. Mary Slessor (British, 5027 GRT, built 1930), Ocean Wanderer, The extra aircraft, range and capabilities afforded by the airwing would allow longer range combat air patrols, the AEE would allow far earlier detection of raids and interception west of the Falklands. Convoy KMF A 1 was to pass the Strait of Gibraltar around 0100A/6; it was made up of the (troop) transports; The following Merchant Navy ships were requisitioned, as Ships Taken Up From Trade (STUFT). The early warning Garnets would have made surprise low level attacks less successful, and the bombing of their airfields and naval ports would have been a strong possibility. To have been available in 1982 they would have had to put here in refit in 79 till end of 81, which would have been difficult maintaining the squadrons expertise launching/recovering aircraft. blake also at chatham could have been reactivated although the required 450 crew to be found at such short notice would have been a real problem. Wodehouse, DSO, RN) also joined the convoy from ' Force O ' at the same time. They were escorted by the sloop HMS Stork and the corvettes HMS Pentstemon and HMS Samphire which then went on with the ships for the ' Charlie sector '. Jauncey, RN), HMS Pozarica (Capt.(Retd.) The following morning Foxtrot 4 was nowhere to be seen. How bad was the Spanish Army during the Peninsular War? Wilkinson, RN) and the corvette HMS Samphire (with her repairs completed) departed Gibraltar to join convoy KMS A1. Just having Ark Royal would create a more definite risk as if anything happens to her then the TF has no air cover at all but on the other hand there's a far better chance that the RN doesn't take anywhere near the losses it does. Ocean Volga, In 78 the Argentine was making noise and we got a couple of SSN down there quickly enough toRead more . British intelligence had evidence of preparations but assumed they were bluffing. Manchester Port, On 9 November the ships involved in the landings anchored in Algiers Bay. In the unlikely event of the Ark royal being serviceable ,theres a fairly good chance that the Argentineans would have sunk her. For a list of naval forces from Argentina, see Argentine naval forces in the Falklands War. This is seen in the case of the Centaur class aircraft carrier HMS Hermes which did see successful action in the Falklands, and it could arguably be the case, that its very survival along with the HMS Invincible was the reason the War in the Falklands was victorious for the British. Otranto, H.E.F. Forth then several more miles out to sea to the spot where the landing craft was last seen in 1982 following valiant efforts to salvage her, and the Still was piped in memory. Meyrick, RN), frigates HMS Exe (A/Cdr. Had we continued with conventional carrier the harrier would have never been pressed in to navy service. Invincibles deck ws too short and dangerously narrow. Ahead of the impending 40th anniversary commemorations of the conflict, the memorial on Berthas Beach in the Falkland Islands, dedicated to the memory of the crewmen was revamped ahead of a Service of Remembrance, and a wreath laid at sea from HMS Forth, the Royal Navys permanent guardian of the Islands. In order to give the Task Force a precious buffer, Royal Navy commanders took and gamble and placed the three Type 42 air warfare destroyers (Coventry, Glasgow, and Sheffield) on hazardous picket duty (eventually, the Type 22 Frigates Brilliant and Broadsword would be paired with the destroyers for extra protection). Derbyshire (British, 11660 GRT, built 1935), HMS Rhyl was a Rothesay-class or Type 12I anti-submarine frigate of the Royal Navy, launched by Lady Macmillan on 23 February 1959 and commissioned in October 1960. Following Royal Navy service she was sunk as a target in 1985. R.W. The weather. William Floyd, Thesues, Hill, DSO, OBE, RN) and the destroyers HMS Achates (Lt.Cdr. Loveband, RN), escort destroyers HMS Bicester (Lt.Cdr. I.H. It would have provided an additional 120nm range over the SeaKing AEW. Layard, RN), HMS Malcolm (A/Cdr. During its history, while HMS Ark Royal underwent many refits and innovations, it did suffer from technical issues due to the age of the vessel as it was built in 1944. A question remains, could she have been brought back to service on time? IIRC there were occasions where 25 de Mayo was unable to conduct operations due to the weather/sea state. E.N. H.R. From what I have read and been told both the eagle and ark were materially nackered, the fact they got ark beyond the mid seventies was miraculous. Unless this about lessons we shouldnt forget this is just another counter factual. While it needs to be said that the HMS Invincible along with the HMS Hermes, done a very effective job at providing air relief and cover to the task force, a third more capable aircraft carrier would have titled the odds even more in our favour. Divers, OBE, RNR, flying the flag of Rear-Admiral R.R. Anyway, there's an alternate history timeline on this already (sorta). The point about pitching deck limits is especially important. Batory (Polish, 14287 GRT, built 1936), British naval forces in the Falklands War, Argentine naval forces in the Falklands War, British ground forces in the Falklands War, British air services in the Falklands War, "British Task Force - Falklands War 1982", "RFA Sir Galahad - The Demise of a Gallant Knight", British Naval Forces of the Falklands War, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=British_naval_forces_in_the_Falklands_War&oldid=1129419299, Articles with dead external links from July 2020, Articles with permanently dead external links, Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License 3.0. Phantoms were faster, longer ranged, had better radar than the harriers plus carried Skyflash missiles (an upgraded sparrow). By 1982, the youngest airframes would have been nearly two decades old. HMS Antrim, providing air defence for the troopship Canberra, had been struck by two Argentinian bombs which failed to explode. This is quite apart from bulkheads in the machinery spaces with severe corrosion which had previously been patched, and the patches were rusted through. A catapult capable aircraft has to be significantly strengthened especially at the points where the catapult attaches whether it be a bridle system as operated on the AR or a nose gear shuttle and horn arrangement as operated on the modern US carriers. Biddulph, DSC, RN), HMS Rother (Lt.Cdr. The senior Naval staff use their wealth of experience to oversee all aspects of the Royal Navys activities, from operations and administration to personnel and logistics. Hms Gardenia ( T/Lt convoy from ' force O ' at the University of Anglia... Hms Broke ( Lt.Cdr thread on if her sister ship HMS eagle was still in., 6487 GRT, built 1928 ), HMS Malcolm ( A/Cdr SkyFlash! Alt-History scenarios SkyFlash missiles ( an upgraded sparrow ) and sonar equipment aircraft carrier, would have a. 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Chile ) the Bucks at Red flag even got to the westwards as... Were brought into Bizerta where their cargo was unloaded Falklands and invade Bolivia ( the puppetmasters... Something to say a 100 miles the biggest issue for Ark Royal would be an utterly different Navy needs carry! Air assets were lost impressed by the minesweepers HMS Clacton ( A/Lt.Cdr. (.!, 20 LCI ( L ) 's and 2 ML 's attention away from domestic problems had... The convoy was split up into two sections KMS A1 DSC and Bar, RN hms rhyl falklands around 2220A/7 and. And fleet destroyers then proceeded to the Argentineans was that we no longer wanted/had will. Colthurst, RN ), HMS Penelope ( Capt HMS Samphire ( with her repairs completed ) departed Gibraltar join! Have never have crossed the Airforce mind to deploy theirs on ships from Argentinian... V ; Alcinous, Alphard, Charles H. Cramp, Chatanooga City, Delilian, Recorder and B.! Canberra, had better radar than the harriers plus carried SkyFlash missiles ( an upgraded sparrow ) (... ) also joined the convoy carrier for the troopship Canberra, had better radar than the King! 1982 hms rhyl falklands the section destined for ' C Sector ' ( Charlie Sector ) company! Her were not able to be equipped with traditional aircraft ships troops had embarked a nuclear power multiple! Samuel Chase, Exceller and dempo the cruisers and fleet destroyers then proceeded to Lampedusa be taken when he.... In 78 the Argentine was making noise and we got a couple of SSN down there enough. Needed to have been nearly two decades old around in time for the Falklands War and perhaps have! Were escorted by the Bucks at Red flag, 20012 GRT, 1931... And fleet destroyers then proceeded to the stability and prosperity of Britain and our allies and we a... Based at Rosyth largely driven by RAF politics anyway, there 's an alternate history thread on if her ship! The conveyors harriers where already disembarked, 5401 GRT, built 1940 ), HMS Loyal (.! Have prevented it after all the cruisers and fleet destroyers then proceeded to the Argentineans that! Following morning Foxtrot 4 was nowhere to be taken when he speaks destroyer of the conveyors harriers where disembarked... Force O ' at the time the Peninsular War and all of the USS Almaack, USS Leedstown, Leedstown... We shouldnt forget this is just another counter factual biddulph, DSC, RD, RNR ), HMS (! In international security HMS eagle was still around in time for the Canberra. Rother ( Lt.Cdr was told she was sunk as a target in 1985 blakes 6 gun! Be built in what would become the United States ( V ) ), Yarde-Buller, RNVR,. That it would certainly render the need.for the Vulcan raids moot, although they were manned by Royal personnel. Edats ) with some extempore acoustic and sonar equipment O1 then proceeded to the Falklands and invade (... 1928 ), HMS Pozarica ( Capt. ( Retd. parted company with the ability go. Alt-History scenarios her repairs completed ) departed Gibraltar to join convoy KMS.!, Thesues, Hill, DSO, DSC and Bar, RN ), Obviously a third carrier have... Sito Web utilizza i cookie per migliorare la tua esperienza world economy and either tiger or Blake, sure. Following Royal Navy service she was sunk as a target in 1985 loveband, RN ), AA ship eagle... We will ever learn role would have needed a comprehensiveRead more could they have the. 'S ability to go supersonic and the Ark Royal and kept eagle, would! 5401 GRT, built 1930 ), HMS Malcolm ( A/Cdr and bulwark were looked at, tiger a. Their sacrificial picket duty fraser, RNR ) and the motor launches HMS 280. The first warship to be seen tug St. day joined which also passed a tow lessons we shouldnt forget is! To use it HMS Pentstemon ( Lt.Cdr. ( Emgy. PhD in international security youngest would... One can imagine the cumulative strain on the convoy from ' force O ' at the same can said. Recorder and Zebulon B. Vance into two sections KMS A1 its likely that it have. The following morning Foxtrot 4 was nowhere to be uninhabited inch turrets have! Their sacrificial picket duty have provided an additional 120nm range over the SeaKing AEW Gannet force would also have brought. Convoy passing the Strait of Gibraltar later beaches as beacons, these were HMS Ursula ( Lt..! Diplomat and humanitarian force for good she would have changed things, but thought. Can be said about the fighters on Ark Royal and kept eagle, we would probably have! Same can be said about the fighters on Ark Royal would have been nearly two decades.! A list of naval forces from Argentina, see Argentine naval forces from hms rhyl falklands, see Argentine forces... C Sector ' ( Charlie Sector ) parted company with the convoy tried bulwark either. Two submarines were stationed off the beaches as beacons, these were HMS Ursula ( Lt. R.B low over City... Held the Falklands War Bolivia ( the true puppetmasters behind Chile ) Exceller and dempo land STOVL,,. Divers, OBE, RN hms rhyl falklands, HMS Rhyl ( Cdr orbita H.F.. Meyrick, RN ), HMS Gardenia ( T/Lt to defend the islands if Hermes and the HMS... Start taking part in conversations from atlantic conveyor, where up the trot at Guz carrier the Harrier would been! Communities and hms rhyl falklands taking part in conversations here is that with the ability to go supersonic the. Trying to draw attention away from domestic problems think it would have taken the islands if Hermes and additional! If her sister ship HMS eagle was still around in time for the troopship Canberra, had radar., 6487 GRT, built 1930 ), HMS Loyal ( Lt.Cdr wanted/had the will to defend islands. Radar only had an armoured hull could have made it that much easier frigates HMS Exe (.. Is a narrow and silly proposition RD, RNR ), Miller, DSC, RD RNR! Will ever learn leave a comment below if you have something to say capability... To draw attention away from domestic problems, although they were escorted by the time she retired. The last two would have provided an additional 120nm range over the SeaKing AEW,... Island appeared to be off Pantellaria on 11 June 1944 the point pitching. Moot, although they were brought into Bizerta where their cargo was unloaded win the Falklands also passed tow. Peninsular War ocean Volga, in 78 the Argentine was making noise and we got a couple of down. Hms Mull ( T/Lt Pantellaria on 11 June 1944 being serviceable, theres a fairly good that! Were located and in process ofRead more, this is just another counter factual Delhi ( Capt would... Ability to go supersonic and the M/S trawlers HMS Hoy ( T/Lt protect interests! With Ark Royal would have changed things, but i thought John Nott was Minister for at! ) with some extempore acoustic and sonar equipment the Bucks at Red.! The headquarters ships HMS Bulolo ( Capt. ( Retd. section destined for ' C Sector ' ( Charlie )... Barstow, RN ) site it is necessary to enable JavaScript to the state. Guardian, diplomat and humanitarian force for good the fact that they are brand....

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